New Codex Shrine

Post by **marzo** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 4:24 pm

So, how is this for the Codex Shrine? I have already also placed eggs and written some code to display the Codex itself (but haven't drawn up the Codex graphic itself).

The shrine is based on the wonderful image from the Mysterious Sosaria website (http://www.surfing.net/ultima/).

Anyway, here are the images:

Feedback wanted!

Crysta the Elf · Post by **Crysta the Elf** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 4:49 pm

oooo... nicely done... i really think thats a good look for it

Crysta the Elf · Post by **Crysta the Elf** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 4:51 pm

oh.. i would suggest some stained glass windows for atmosphere

Crysta the Elf · Post by **Crysta the Elf** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 4:56 pm

oh.. and an ankh or two on teh wall behind the codex altar.. it IS virtue-related after all

Post by **marzo** » Fri Jun 17, 2005 4:58 pm

Yeah, I am still doing the windows. I am thinking about having either, windows with ankhs or windows with the codex symbol. I will post the window graphics when they're done so they can be voted on.

Post by **marzo** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 7:27 am

I uploaded the window grqaphics; the interior screenshot above should be different now. So: which window is better, the one with the ankh or the one with the Codex symbol?

My personal preference is the ankh, despite the amount of work it took to make the Codex symbol -- although the latter looks rather good with Super 2xSai. I am also willing to change the glass color, although the number of choices is rather small.

Gruck · Post by **Gruck** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 7:39 am

I like them both. I don't see why the shrine can't have both.

Crysta the Elf · Post by **Crysta the Elf** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 7:49 am

the virtue symbol on the floor needs more shading... it looks a bit TOO flat right now

Post by **marzo** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 8:58 am

I like them both. I don't see why the shrine can't have both.

Hmmm. that is an interesting idea. An ankh on the left and the Codex symbol on the right. I think I'll keep it.

the virtue symbol on the floor needs more shading... it looks a bit TOO flat right now

I am not sure I am following you; I meant the symbol to be part of the carpet -- did you think it was something else?

Post by **Dominus** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 9:34 am

I like it a lot. It has been a feature request from me in the tracker from ages ago

Crysta the Elf · Post by **Crysta the Elf** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 9:38 am

what i mean is it sticks out

it looks like a set of poorly drawn MS pant lines superimposed over a video game carpet

there has to be SOME shading to smooth the edges

Crysta the Elf · Post by **Crysta the Elf** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 9:47 am

or.. darker colors at least... sorry if that was a bit.. uh.. rude.. 6_6;

Gradilla Dragon · Post by **Gradilla Dragon** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 10:04 am

Hmm... the purple line is overlapping all the lines it intersects. Isn't there supposed to be a balance between those it overlaps and those it goes underneath?

To make it look balanced with the least modifications, the intersections that need to be "fixed" are:
purple-red
purple-orange
orange-yellow

Sissy Knox- not logged in :( · Sat Jun 18, 2005 10:11 am

Great! Now, all we need is the Codex disco and we're all set.

Re: The floor symbol. The blue rug has a sort of dithered pattern in it to give the illusion of a carpet texture. The symbol should have something similar, so it will look like part of the rug. It wouldn't require redrawing the pattern, just a simple recolor or pattern fill.

If you like, send me the original artwork, and I'll gladly give it a go.

Post by **marzo** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 2:42 pm

Multiple replies in one post:

Crysta: Ah, got it. The reason why it looked like "a poorly drawn MS paint lines superimposed over a video game carpet" is because it was exactly that. Well, except that I use Gimp, but the rest was pretty accurate

I uploaded new versions from the inside and the outside; I slightly changed the size of the shrine so that the roof looks more like the one from "Mysterious Sosaria". How does the new carpet look?

Gradilla: Had forgotten about that; I used your suggestion for the intersections.

Sissy: thanks for the offer, but it won't be necessary. I actually like working with pixels

Now, the next thing I am planning to do is changing the layout of the surrounding area a bit, doing the following:
1) moving the entrance of the nearby dungeon to another spot (I doubt that any of the Fellowship would be able to get past the guardians...);
2) removing the walls behind said guardians and replace them with an invisible wall (and a message by the guardians);
3) overriding the magic carpet so that you can't land past the guardians (unless you are on a quest ot see the Codex);
4) overridding "Mark" spell so that you can no longer mark it past the guardians.

Any other ideas/suggestions?

Crysta the Elf · Post by **Crysta the Elf** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 3:33 pm

i think the symbol may still be a bit too bright.. but.. it looks a lot better

Post by **marzo** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 3:37 pm

It is likely the yellow/orange. I'll see what I can do about it.

Crysta the Elf · Post by **Crysta the Elf** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 4:43 pm

could i suggest a spot to move the entrance to?

just south of where it is now, on the outer mountains jsut west of the statues.... the southern mountain wall is thin there and leads into a room where a few fellowship fanatics are preparing before leading to the room with the "throne of the guardian".. a small cave and pair of iron doors would be good there....will require almost no changes to the dungeon at all ;P

yhevhe · Post by **yhevhe** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 5:52 pm

Here's my little opinion/suggestion - sorry if I'm asking too much...

Currently, the shrine doesn't gives that feeling the Mysterious Sosaria's one does, I feels more 'heavy and cold', maybe it's the stone color, dunno. So, intead of making stained glass windows, I was imagining those small windows that are directly made in the stone, like the ones in the castles, but with ankh shape.

Post by **marzo** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 6:10 pm

Yes, I thought about that spot too. I ended up placing the entrance in the SW corner of the guardian's throne room (and rotated the throne to face the new entrance). I decided against the other area because it is sort of a dorm/dining room area.

Post by **marzo** » Sat Jun 18, 2005 7:22 pm

There, I uploaded the new graphic. I darkened the yellow and the orange most, but blue also a little. More than that makes yellow and orange very hard to distinguish, and makes the blue begin to fade into the carpet.

Crysta the Elf · Post by **Crysta the Elf** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 2:10 am

id say its more or less perfect

Gradilla Dragon · Post by **Gradilla Dragon** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 5:37 am

I think the either the yellow should be a little lighter, or the orange a little darker. At the current point I can hardly distinguish them.

Post by **marzo** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 8:18 am

I toned yellow up by one shade; I think it looks rather good now.

I was imagining those small windows that are directly made in the stone, like the ones in the castles, but with ankh shape.

Which ones? Last I looked, the castles had one of the following types of windows: stained glass (LB's & Empath Abbey), wooden windows (Lycaeum), iron bars (Isle of Fire) or none at all (Serpent's Hold).

There are also smaller stained-glass-like windows in LB's castle which are not big enough for the ankh.

yhevhe · Post by **yhevhe** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 4:47 pm

I think that in U7 there are not that kind of windows...

I mean windows like this or this one.

yhevhe · Post by **yhevhe** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 4:48 pm

Post by **marzo** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 4:01 am

Oh, you mean *real* castle windows. It is an idea, but wouldn't fit in the game -- not only do all in-game castles have windows unlike that, but an important monument such as the Codex shrine certainly wouldn't have them.

Post by **Dominus** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 4:09 am

Now after you are done finishing my #1 feature request, you could do my #2: After finishing the lake something (by cove) quest, have it gradually cleaned

Crysta the Elf · Post by **Crysta the Elf** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 4:20 am

you mean intead of cleaned instantly like now, right?

Gradilla Dragon · Post by **Gradilla Dragon** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 4:23 am

Loch Lake

Post by **Dominus** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 4:25 am

Thanks Gradilla, that's the one I mean

Crysta, you are making a joke, right?
It never gets cleaned. I wasted hours in the game, cleaning that damn lake myself. Those damn dirty people from Britain...

Post by **marzo** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 4:31 am

The one for lake cove is rather easy to do. Just place a few strategically placed eggs which activate when the chunk is cached in. Each time the egg is activated, have it remove 10 or so random pieces of garbage. Yeah, I can do it

On another topic, I have added back the Eternal Flames of Courage, Truth and Love to their respective keeps as well. Unfortunately, it isn't possible to add a new floor to the Lycaeum for the Flame of Truth, so it had to remain in the second floor -- but there was a good spot for it there. The Flame of Courage gained its secluded basement chamber, even. I will post screenshots tonight.

Crysta the Elf · Post by **Crysta the Elf** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 4:34 am

huh? o_O;

i swear i remember it being clean suddenly...... o_O;;

Crysta the Elf · Post by **Crysta the Elf** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 4:35 am

hey dom.. question... what CD do you have that has Ultima 7 on it? i mean like.. Ultima Collection or what?

Post by **Dominus** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 4:45 am

Crysta: I have the complete U7, two Ulima Collections and a floppy disk version.

Marzo sounds great, and if done correctly it wouldn't kill the good stuff off (like the odies with loot and the key to the hoe shed...
I really like your corrections to the two games.

Crysta the Elf · Post by **Crysta the Elf** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 4:51 am

well i was thinking my "false memories" might have been from an actual fixed version.. i had Complete Ultima 7 as well.. have you tried it on that?

im sorry if its annoying.. i just swear i remember it being cleaned >.<

Post by **marzo** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 4:55 am

Yeah, in the end it will even make the shed's key easier to find... and the way I am planning to do it, the loot would simply be placed in the ground. Any garbage they leave would gradually be cleaned as well with future calls.

I will only have to make a hack for certain areas of the lake (the ones filled with a sickly green goo), since those areas cannot really be cleaned that way.

Gradilla Dragon · Post by **Gradilla Dragon** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 5:00 am

But isn't someone going to take that stuff? Someone is likely to take the key. I think the removal of that key should be there to add a challenge. "Find it before the lake is cleaned up".

Post by **marzo** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 5:02 am

That is an idea. But in any case, someone can use the other key near the chest south of Trinsic (which, BTW, also opens the chest). Or a barrel of gunpowder.

Natreg · Post by **Natreg** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 6:22 am

Or you can add the option "key" to the conversation with the mayor of Cove when the lake is cleaned saying something like "we found this key when we cleaned the lake", and he gives it to you (just in case you haven´t found it yourself)

Post by **Dominus** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 6:45 am

i just swear i remember it being cleaned

Sorry, but we've already proven that to be faulty in other areas. The Loch Lake does not get cleaned in the official version. Believe me.

Post by **artaxerxes** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 7:15 am

IMHO, that's a very brilliant idea.

Artaxerxes

Post by **drcode** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 7:58 am

I like that too, as I can never remember where the damn key is located.

SB-X · Post by **SB-X** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 11:10 am

The one for lake cove is rather easy to do. Just place a few strategically placed eggs which activate when the chunk is cached in. Each time the egg is activated, have it remove 10 or so random pieces of garbage. Yeah, I can do it

You mean if I walk a couple screens away and walk back half the garbage will be cleaned? And if I immediately repeat that, the rest of the garbage will be gone? Is that much better than immediately cleaning it all? But I don't have a better solution.

Crysta: Could you be thinking of the SNES version? I played that too, and I vaguely recalled the lake being cleaned up too. It indeed isn't in the PC version.

DrCode is planning to use the conversation option as a "feature" to avoid having to look for the key. Get the lake cleaned up and the mayor gives it to you.

Crysta the Elf · Post by **Crysta the Elf** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 11:17 am

no, its not the SNES version im thinking of >.>;

Olarin · Post by **Olarin** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 12:19 pm

giving the mayor a conversation option for the key if it gets cleaned up makes sense, but as for the ordinary loot, i think it should just dissapear with the bodies it's in. i don't think your average brittanian community service worker is going to, upon discovering a valuable item mixed in with garbage, is going to just leave it on the ground under the assumption that the avatar may just happen to come along and need it.

Olarin · Post by **Olarin** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 12:26 pm

with respect to adding a third floor to the lycaeum - just out of curiosity, how much would it screw up BG to give it the functionality for third floors that SI has, so that such modifications could be made? this would also allow someone to expand castle brittania and perhaps a few other key buildings, and maybe add lighthouses or something.

Post by **marzo** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 12:36 pm

You mean if I walk a couple screens away and walk back half the garbage will be cleaned?

Several screens more likely. But I can always add a timer to control that -- all eggs can share the same timer and the cleaning up based on how many hours elapsed since the last cleaning session.

Post by **marzo** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 6:30 pm

OK, Lock Lake cleaning is implemented and working nicely. It results in a crystal clear lake after several days, although the exact number varies. If you check in periodically, you will be able to see partial stages of cleaning.

Sissy Knox- not logged in :( · Mon Jun 20, 2005 8:58 pm

That's seriously cool! One time, I cleaned up the lake myself- I edited the chunks and everything. Of course, the garbage all came back eventually...><

I always think it's funny when the Guardian, in UUII goes..."My associates and I are embarking on a little vacation! I hear the beaches on...Cove...are nice."

Then I think...sheesh, Guardian...what Cove are YOU talking about? In my memory, Cove's shoreline is completely polluted and nasty (I know you can have Lord Heather sign the bill- just when I think of Cove, I think of flies and trash). Maybe the Guardian would like that sort of thing, I don't know.